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Coming Soon : Seven Years War

4 years 8 months ago #1 by remus

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  • Hi all
    I want to present a little teaser for anyone interested in The Seven Years war.I have included the screenshots below of a small example of Austrian and Prussian musketeer battalions.These screenshots are from my testing of the sprites in game and I am almost finished adjustments as necessary. The good news is that once I am happy with how these examples work, I will be able to enter the remainder of the sprites required for the first OOB which will be the Battle of Leuthen. This hopefully should be in the near future.If you are new to the forum and have an in interest in 18th Century warfare then while you are waiting for SYW why not try the American War of Independence which I have posted below this one.

    Enjoy,Remus

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    4 years 8 months ago - 4 years 8 months ago #2 by remus

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  • Just to add to the introduction.The Seven years War 1756-1763 is some times referred to at times as the first World War, as many nations especially in Europe were involved. For example some of the Major nations allied with Austria include France,Russia,Spain,Saxony, Sweden and the Holy Roman Empire.Prussian allies were England,Portugal and Hanover.Both sides had also minor states allied to them i.e. Bavaria,Hessen-Darmstadt,Modena,Palatinate and Wurttemberg were allied with Austria with Brunswick-Wolfenbuttel,Hessen- Kassel and Schaumberg-Lippe on the side of Prussian and her allies.

    From the above examples as you can see there is plenty of variety to choose from. My focus is to try and include as many of these nations and the battles that were fought by them into the game. It will take time but it is possible.

    Cheers Remus
    Last edit: 4 years 8 months ago by remus. Reason: Mistake correction
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    4 years 7 months ago #3 by mdwn15

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  • The Conquest of Canada with Battle of Sainte-Foy, Plains of Abraham, Beauport, Quebec...are in the Seven Years War...would be also possible to play or do you have to created more sprites ex native american civ canadian... thank you to this beautiful mod the pictures are already great good job.

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    4 years 7 months ago #4 by Saddletank

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  • The 'world war' label comes from the war not being restricted to Europe but being global with battles fought on land and sea in N America, the Caribbean and India.

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    4 years 7 months ago #5 by remus

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  • Hi Saddletank and mdwn15

    Thanks for your input. I appreciate your points of view of the World War label and certainly I would like to cover battles within that particular scope. My first priority would be the battles in Europe as I have more information at the moment. If the era proves popular enough then I would be happy to continue battles in other areas of conflict. I did in fact do a an OOB for the Battle the Plains of Abraham when Alessillo did SYW for the old TC2M game and I think It might still be around.You can appreciate that working solo, the task is time consuming and that is a factor as well.

    Remus

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    4 years 7 months ago #6 by remus

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  • Hi all

    Some screenshots of hussars, curassiers and dragoons

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    4 years 7 months ago - 4 years 7 months ago #7 by remus

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  • Forgot some Austrian hussars


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    Hope you enjoy
    Remus
    Last edit: 4 years 7 months ago by remus. Reason: mistake
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    4 years 7 months ago #8 by Saddletank

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  • The sprites look very nice, especially the Prussian grenadiers.

    Do you plan to raise the flags up so they look like the unit is carrying them, rather than having them behind the unit? They look a bit curious down there.

    I'd stick to Europe - there are so many nations to cover. The Swedes and Russians are my favourites. I used to own 15mil armies of both nations.

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    4 years 7 months ago #9 by Davinci

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  • remus - Excellent looking Graphics !

    How long does it take to create each unit using the program that you are using?

    davinci

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    4 years 7 months ago #10 by remus

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  • Hi Davinci

    I use 3ds max and I could have about 3 to 4 unit types ready for game from woe to go in about eight hrs. Unfortunately I have no experience in writing scripts so I have to work through each step manually which eats into the time.This can include modifying/repainting uniforms etc.

    Saddletank

    I will eventually get the flags to where they should be. Everything in the screenshots at the moment as you see them are wips and a result of testing to see if they appear in the game. I will be including more grenadier types and prussian fusiliers as well as grenzers and curassiers/grenadiers for Austria

    Remus

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    4 years 7 months ago #11 by mdwn15

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  • Hi Remus thank you to yours added comments...now Montcalm have to defend Quebec again...this mod look great...we can see or imagine far away on the battlefield the giants grenadiers from the <<Alte Fritz>> awaiting the enemy create fear just by showing their large size. :woohoo:

    read just if you are interresting about story !!!

    www.historyanswers.co.uk/history-of-war/the-potsdam-giants-how-the-king-of-prussia-bred-an-army-of-super-soldiers/

    In fact:

    He wanted just a guard as there were in all countries at the time (an elite regiment dedicated to guard the sovereign in peace, as the Maison du Roy in France, the Life Guard in England, the Chevaliers-Gardes in Russia, etc.). Only, it was indeed a fixette for great soldiers, and indeed he moved heaven and earth in all countries then to recruit the greatest men you can find. But now, suddenly it was right for her robes, the Guard (a regiment of barely 3,000 men) was good to remain at attention in front of the foreign personalities knowing that these giants were mostly foreign peasants who had never held a gun in their lives.

    It was only for show; unlike other guards (Imperial Guard in France under Napoleon, Knights-Gardes in Russia under Alexander I, etc.) that grouped the best soldiers of a country, and therefore could be used in combat, the regiment of giants was made up of peasants, monks, bakers and other trains-slippers recruited or abducted (truthful) throughout Europe. Frederick I do not intend to fight, and the few times she actually fought it did not do much (she went to the French after Jena in 1806,) ;)

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    4 years 7 months ago #12 by remus

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  • Hi all
    A new set of screenshots showing new unit types for the initial OOB of the Battle of Leuthen. The first two shots are of the Grenzer Battalions that fought for the Austrian empire. These are classed as frontier troops and also known at times as Pandurs. The third is of Austrian curassiers

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    The next four shots are of the four variations of the austrian musketeers ie AustroHungarian, red, green and blue


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    The next four shots contain the Bavarian contingent these will be slightly different in the final game,and the next three are shots of the prussian fusiliers note the smaller mitre caps.

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    Finally the next shots are a panoramic view of a game test.

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    The game played played out over two hours and there was no problems. I actually had a win playing the Prussians who are outnumbered almost 2 to 1.I still have a few more additions to include. Working on the artillery at the moment. Shouldn't be too long now.

    Enjoy
    Remus
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    4 years 6 months ago #13 by remus

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  • Hi all

    This is probably the last of the screenshots I'll be posting. These two are Austrian and Prussian 12lb cannons. I'm hoping to include some 3lb battalion guns which will look similar but it depends on how the memory goes. Anyway it shouldn,t be too long now


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    4 years 6 months ago - 4 years 6 months ago #14 by Michael Slaunwhite

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  • Thank You Remus. I'm looking forward too this mod.

    Cheers, and take care.
    Last edit: 4 years 6 months ago by Michael Slaunwhite.

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    4 years 5 months ago - 4 years 5 months ago #15 by Wenzel

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  • Hello remus!

    This looks very promising! Thanks for taking up this war that is largely forgotten by the world of wargamers! Wargaming seems to be an anglo-centric hobby, while in some parts of Europe, military history is frowned upon (I guess that - somewhat understandably - the world wars have rendered "military history" a frowned-upon hobby in Austria and Germany, for example).

    I think I can call myself a Silesian-Wars-afficionado. I've been working on a giant mod (portaying the Kolin capaign in central Bohemia) for AGEOD's rise of Prussia with completely overhauled mechanics, troops, and a new map, but the huge amount of work needed to paint and image-map the map kind of defeated me (so the project is on hold for now). AGEOD has updated their forum recently, so the images are all (still) missing, but maybe you're interested:

    www.ageod-forum.com/viewtopic.php?f=267&t=35358 (MOD "Silesia Inrupta")
    www.ageod-forum.com/viewtopic.php?f=267&t=34956 (Unit graphics)

    I've never really played the Scourge of War games in depth, partly because I was not interested in the topic (US civil war), partly because the mechanics seemed strange to me (the real killer for me is the lack of colisions/disorder - battalions have no footprint, soldiers simply organize themselves around the battalion's center-point, thus all units move by far too flexibly and can move through each other without any malus; it's polonaises all over the place) but your mod might raise my interest. Are you planning to expand on this mod, or will it just be an aesthetical/uniform mod? I might be interested to delve into modding game mechanics to suit my idea of mid 18th century warfare a bit more.

    The models look very nice. Apart from some matters of taste regarding the uniforms (or rather the effect weather would have on them), there is only one point that really made me wonder: The horses are much too big (especially for dragoons and hussars). Is that an issue of the stock/vanilla game?

    PS: Here are some of my unit icons for the WIP-mod for inspiration - I based them on period artwork, not on uniform plates à la Knötel and Osprey as most of them seem rather inaccurate to me (especially the Prussians, since they're based on the Prussian uniforms of the 1780s, not the 1750s).

    If you have any questions or need period material please let me know!
    Last edit: 4 years 5 months ago by Wenzel.

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    4 years 5 months ago #16 by remus

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  • Hello Wenzel

    Thank you for your post.Like yourself this is one of my favorite wars. The different uniforms are part of the attraction as well. Having bought and played Empire Total War and also Rise of Prussia I ended up frustrated by the lack of immersion in the period. Scourge of War was an opportunity for me to immerse myself in the research of the uniforms and also the history of the era.

    As you pointed out there are problems with some of the mechanics of the gameplay but it still offers me the opportunity to see opposing armies in action, of a period I love, in a way that neither of the two games mentioned above were ever able to do. To my knowledge there is no game out there that will come close to experiencing what SOW can deliver.

    My vision with the SYW period is to reproduce as much of the Battles that occurred during that time as possible. As you would know this will include battles with the French,Russians,British and minor states as well.

    The mod which will be released in the near future will not be perfect either. I am an amateur and would have done this for my own satisfaction. Constraints of the engine for example will not allow me do do absolutely every uniform that units wore, so I have to work with the tools I possess.The range of horses for example are limited to me as I converted them but don't scratch build them. At least not yet. Uniforms are based on Project Syw and may or may not be totally accurate but the resource is a good one and as you have stated it takes a lot of work not only painting but preparing to put in game.

    I am hoping with the release of the mod that I will get positive feedback on things that will improve it. Formations may not be perfect at the moment but others with more knowledge can input and the mod itself will evolve to a better product.

    Hope I answered some of your questions
    Remus

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    4 years 5 months ago #17 by Wenzel

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  • Thank you for your answer! If you need info on any habsburg-army-related topic let me know. Over the years, I've acquired quite a small library on AWS & 7YW related stuff and could help you out if you have any particular questions.

    I've reinstalled SOW Gettysbourgh and l'm looking forward to the release of your uniforms. I've downloaded the SDK and will take a look at what's possible as far as modding the game-mechanics is concerned over the next few evenings. Right now, I'm afraid gameplay does not seem very convincing to me for several reasons, but perhaps I can tweak movement and fire-combat-resolution to my liking. It just seems so wrong to see battalions move through each other so easily and and manoeuvre flawlessly under enemy fire. But I'm not going to highjack your topic with my modding-jabber.

    May I ask you how you do these sprites? You've mentioned that you use 3ds max. I'm a total noob at 3d modelling. So, you've got a 3d model and take snapshots from it from several angles and in several positions?

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    4 years 5 months ago - 4 years 5 months ago #18 by remus

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  • Wenzel asked?

    "May I ask you how you do these sprites? You've mentioned that you use 3ds max. I'm a total noob at 3d modelling. So, you've got a 3d model and take snapshots from it from several angles and in several positions?"

    Hi Wenzel
    Yes that is pretty much how it works. Problem is it can be labor intensive.

    "but perhaps I can tweak movement and fire-combat-resolution to my liking. It just seems so wrong to see battalions move through each other so easily and and manoeuvre flawlessly under enemy fire

    Anything that you could contribute in this area would be appreciated. Any feedback on SYW once its released as long as it makes for a better experience will be very welcome

    Remus
    Last edit: 4 years 5 months ago by remus.

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    4 years 5 months ago - 4 years 5 months ago #19 by Wenzel

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  • Allright! So I will open up a new thread for my experiments with mechanics (and also sounds) as soon as I've figured out what is possible and what not. Even though the core of my "problem" seems to be written in stone (units' footprints are points, not shapes, and there are no means to detect "colisions" between units) I have some general ideas how to adjust the game to be more to my liking and also a bit closer to mid 18th century warfare as I understand it.

    E.g. I think of replacing "fatigue" (which is more of a long-term-factor) with "cohesion/order" (more of a short-term factor), and I will pay special attention to proper precautions for movement and surprise - if marching units loose cohesion, being caught flat-footed should be really bad - ideally, players are encouraged to screen their movements with troops that loose less cohesion on the march (medium and light cavalry, elite/light infantry such as grenadiers and grenzers). The advance guard is supposed to keep the enemy at bay until the main force is ready for battle (is deployed and has recovered fatigue=cohesion). Manoeuvering of this kind did not neccessarily play a large role in the actual big clashes (but on a large scale, consider e.g. Rossbach or Torgau, where large bodies of troops "manoeuvered" into battle), but there were many many smaller engagements throughout the war offsides the big battles (you'll get an idea by reading the "Großer Generalstab" very carefully or also the Journal of Horace St. Paul). I'm more interested in these smaller, very flexible engagements as I consider them more interesting from a gamers' perspective, and I think the SOW-maps are large enough to allow for some interesting manoeuvres.

    I'm looking forward to your models! :)
    Last edit: 4 years 5 months ago by Wenzel.

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    4 years 5 months ago #20 by Saddletank

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  • You may find that converting a version of this mod to the Waterloo engine will pay you dividends since the AI.dll file in that game allows a lot more modding options. The KS mods have abandoned 'fatigue' as a concept and opted for 'cohesion' as well. It makes a lot more sense.

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    4 years 5 months ago - 4 years 5 months ago #21 by Wenzel

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  • Thanks for the info, Saddletank! Can I use the same SDK/file structure for Waterloo as for Gettysbourgh?

    The Kriegsspiel-mod sounds very interesting by the way and indeed seems to adress some aspects which I wanted to tweak as well (plus I'm always playing HITS and with courier messages). I'm downloading right now and will have a closer look at it.
    Last edit: 4 years 5 months ago by Wenzel.

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    4 years 5 months ago #22 by Saddletank

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  • There is a Napoleonic Mod for the Gettysburg game by the KS group. The current mod is for Waterloo only. We moved to the new game because the modding potential is greater.

    If you are modding Gettysburg I would stick to the Gettysburg SDK as there are some significant differences with WL.

    One benefit of HITS play is that most of the graphical anomalies of units merging through each other isn't so obvious than it is with an elevated camera view so the immersion feels better even though it isn't!

    If you have Waterloo you are very welcome to try an MP game with us as more realism and immersion is what we prefer as well (up to a point - gameplay and entertainment has its place as well).

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    4 years 5 months ago #23 by remus

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  • Hi Saddletank

    Are there any major differences in converting to Waterloo or is it just a case of using a Waterloo specific spreadsheet. If it is not too complicated then I would consider using it for future mods

    Remus

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    4 years 5 months ago #24 by Saddletank

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  • The biggest difference I know is the vegetation and troop sprites are packed in a different way. I'm not a sprite modder though so someone like MTG is best to answer such questions.

    There is a names file (xml file) needed that has to be taken from the OOB to let the user interface display the unit/commander names correctly but the KS Group has a very quick and simple xml file creator for modders to use; it makes the necessary file in an instant.

    Lastly as regards to tactics Waterloo has squares which the SYW did not, so you need to work around this issue but there are ways it can be done (such as, instead of a square, make the infantry form a "reinforced line" or something like that). I have been toying with the idea of a generic mid-18th century mod for use in a campaign design I've been thinking about for a year or more. If I were to use WL to mod for this I'd go with something like that.

    If you are interested in a team effort, drop me a PM and I'll give you my e-mail.

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